The Ultimate Guide to Making Money with Brand Deals!

Wow, I cannot believe how much value is packed into this single episode! It’s basically a full-blown course on how find and manage brand deals for your YouTube channel. We even talk about Instagram deals, too. Chad Rader, who does 6 figure brand deals on YouTube with brands like Disney and Best Buy, reveals everything you need to know about how to make money on YouTube with brand deals and sponsorships.

We discuss…

00:00 Video Intro
02:50 Finding Brand Deals
05:40 Negotiating
07:23 Determine Your Value
12:41 Managing Business Relationships
16:09 Setting Up Contracts
23:26 Fulfilling the Contract
27:38 Revisions
28:44 Follow Up
31:02 Brand Deals on Instagram
32:34 Your Questions

Check out Chad’s channel at GabeBabeTV: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0VcpXqaW4m_JsHVGlOqb-w

Examples of Chad’s brand deals:

— HBO Max dedicated video — https://youtu.be/hnrzpZGI-YE
— Visible dedicated video — https://youtu.be/Avj319znWT4
— Dove Men + Care dedicated video — https://youtu.be/Io8U9PR29fQ
— Google integrates video — https://youtu.be/ijiUrjzoPVU
— Vistaprint (IG only): https://www.instagram.com/p/CFiMGyjJa-O/?igshid=112qrkjmf03sa
— Danimals (IG only): https://www.instagram.com/p/CEcdkwkDBQ7/?igshid=fcevgmnn9r2g

Download our FREE guide, "Product to Profit," to follow our process for turning your audience into a profitable business: https://videocreators.com/product-to-profit/

Looking for a lawyer to review your brand deal contracts with you? This is Tim’s lawyer for his YouTube needs: https://kunklelaw.com/

Here’s the video we reference in the episode about how to write a media deck for brand deals: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ASGsaPpsFyU

Here’s a playlist of other helpful videos about how to make money on YouTube with brand deals: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLvxDZJe1lbabi7C4fOgpIqS8-zwWnwo2Z

LOVE VIDEO CREATORS AND WANT TO GROW ON YOUTUBE? HERE ARE SOME NEXT STEPS!

1) SUBSCRIBE to learn how to grow your YouTube channel!
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCcB3bcWy0_QK7uPQvTD0LwQ?sub_confirmation=1

2) FREE GUIDE: "The Secret to Building your YouTube Audience"

The Secret to Growing your YouTube Audience

3) BECOME A MEMBER: Access special community perks on our channel and support our trainings by clicking that Join button! Or, click here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCcB3bcWy0_QK7uPQvTD0LwQ/join

4) LET’S CONNECT!
— https://www.facebook.com/videocreators
— https://twitter.com/timschmoyer
— https://instagram.com/timschmoyer
— https://instagram.com/videocreators

5) SUBSCRIBE TO THE VIDEO CREATORS PODCAST
— iTunes: http://go.vcreators.co/vcTViTunes
— Soundcloud: http://go.vcreators.co/vcTVSoundCloud
— Stitcher: http://go.vcreators.co/vcTVStitcher
— Google Play: http://go.vcreators.co/vcTVGooglePlay
— Spotify: https://go.vcreators.co/vcTVSpotify

6) LET’S REVIEW YOUR CHANNEL: Book a private one-on-one YouTube channel consultation with Tim or someone on his team: https://videocreators.com/youtube-certified-consultant/

=================== text video ====================

— This is Chad from GabeBabe TV,

and he’s been on YouTube
for over nine years now.

And this guy is an expert
when it comes to brand deals

on YouTube, on Instagram.

Every time I talk to Chad
he is blowing my mind with

here’s how it works.

Here’s what the processes are.

Here’s the negotiations.

Here’s how we do contracts.

Here’s how we start the conversation.

I’m like, «Oh my gosh, like
we need to get this on video.»

And so today, Chad wants to give you,

— Probably tired of hearing it.

— unload his brain into yours

and give you a crash course.

Everything you need to know
about brand deals on YouTube.

How to land them,

how to make money,

and grow your audience doing
it all at the same time.

(Ominous music)

Hey, guys, my name is Tim Schmoyer.

Welcome to «Video Creators»

where we are all about helping you guys

as established YouTube creators

in order to take next level steps,

and tactics to grow your business

and your audience here on YouTube,

and Chad’s been doing
that for a long time.

So take us back to the beginning,

your very first brand deal,

how did that come about?

Where were you guys as a channel,

and how that feels just getting
to go to the whole process?

— Well, kind of embarrassing,

but so we were, I would say

at this point we were 2014 maybe.

And we got offered our first brand deal,

and it was for an app called Hot or Not.

We’ll move on from that quickly.

It was really dumb for us to even do it,

but we had fun with it.

They pay us like $500.

We were excited, you know,
it was pretty exciting and—

— Go from zero to 500,

it sounds like a big deal.
— That’s what I’m saying,

yeah, it was $500 to sit on the couch

and talk about something.
— Yeah.

— And so little did we
know that that you know,

from that point on it just would kind

of floodgates would open

and we would just get this
crash course you know,

of on the job training
of dealing with brands.

— Here you are nine years later,

and I’m putting you on
the spot for some numbers.

How many brand deals would
you say you’ve done overall

in the past nine years?

— We’ve worked with over 800 brands

and I would say that we’re
probably close to double that

in brand deals.

— Okay, so you’ve done
multiple deals with each brand?

— Yes.

— And what were some of
the brands name drop some.

— You know, we’ve worked
with Samsung, Honda, Hyundai,

you know, the HelloFreshes
of the world you know,

all that kind of Sun
Basket those type of deals.

We’ve worked with Harry’s
the shaving, you know that.

I worked with them probably
40 times for a long time.

Walmart in various various ways,

including some national
Walmart commercials,

we did nine commercials with them,

and then some social as well.

Target’s J. C. Penney,
Disney, Crack mac and cheese,

and we could go on.
— Yeah, it’s a lot of them.

— It’s been an absolute blessing

to think about all of
those brands if you know,

we’ve grew up on them,

and now all of a sudden
we’ve worked with them

in a business capacity.

It’s pretty cool.
— Yeah, yeah.

How did these brands find you?

— Majority of time when
brands reach out to us,

it’s not the brand it’s an agency.

You know what I’ve noticed
is over the years now

brands are using their
agencies that may be helped

with their marketing or
their their PR stuff,

and even reaching out
to celebrity, you know,

clients to get, you know, commercials,

traditional commercials
and things of that sort.

Now, what they’ve done,

I think that they’ve got
a whole ‘nother arm now

that they’ve added for
working with influencers.

And so they have teams that are literally

just watching YouTube,

searching through Instagram,

searching Facebook,

and they you know, they’ve
reached out and say,

«Hey, we saw your guy’s
content on YouTube,»

or, «we saw you on Facebook, or Instagram,

we think you’d be perfect
for this campaign.»

— So is there anything that you would say

that you would recommend

that would make their content
more likely that a brand

weather you’ve discover them,

and if they do get discovered,
— Yeah.

— will make it more likely
that the brand would reach out

to contact them in the first place?

— Yeah, I think that’s a good question,

and I think that it does
start with putting out content

that is brand safe.
— What does that mean?

— So what I mean by that
is content that you know,

a brand like for instance,

let’s use Disney is not
gonna reach out to someone

that is putting out content
with cuss word after cuss word,

sexual references, things
that it’s this risqué,

because that’s not their brand, right?

— There’s other brands
that that might be—

— Exactly, so it’s your kind of content,

if that’s what you wanna do

then follow your heart,

do your thing,

but understand that there
are gonna be certain brands

that aren’t necessarily gonna reach out.

When you’re smaller and if
we would have known that

this would be something I
probably would have told myself

you know, six, seven, eight years ago

to reach out to brands.

We have never reached out to a brand

not in nine years.
— They’ve all come to you.

— Yeah, they’ve all come to us

which you know, you can
be like, «That’s cool,»

but then you also may be like,

«Man, we maybe we miss some
some opportunities here.»

But I think that small chance,

if you have a smaller channel,

and I think that you
know, you’re growing that,

and you wanna work with brands,

I mean, I think that it’s absolutely okay

for you to create yourself a media kit.

Create yourself a little here’s what I am,

here’s who I am,

here’s what I can, you know, offer you,

and send it off.

The worst they’re gonna do is not respond,

or say that, you know, «We’re
not interested right now,»

but the other side of
that is you might be able

to get a product for some content.

— If you guys wanna know more about

how to create a media kit
with interactive card pop up

there’s link down below

where I walk you through it step by step,

what media deck looks like,

and how you use that
to reach out to brands.

I’ve had experienced several
times of reaching out

to brands like, «Oh, I
just wanna work with them,

’cause they seem cool.»
— Yeah.

And I’m a bit surprised
how many times now,

especially more recently
those brands have been like,

«We’ve been wanting to get
in influencer marketing,

and we just weren’t sure where to start.

Thank you for reaching out,»
— Absolutely.

— like, how do we do this thing,

and then you get to be in the
position of teaching them,

and showing them,

and so it’s kind of like,
they literally thank us

for reaching out.

— You know, I think the biggest
thing with brand deals is

in the beginning it’s okay
to do things for no money.

The opportunities are
gonna come from there.

— And that you have
something to show the brand

that wants to pay you like,

«Hey, I’ve done this before.
— That’s what I’ve done.

— Here’s an example,»

and they’re like, «Oh,
yeah, that looks awesome,

like you did a great job.

Cool, yeah, you’re worth $500,»

or (mumbles).
— Exactly,

and I think that yeah, and with rates,

that’s another piece that
valuing yourself is important.

You know, you’re gonna do some research.

You can look at, you know,
there’s some tools out there,

and I think it’s important that people,

you know, do that research,

and then understand that, you know,

you might get negotiated down,

or it might be, you might
not get paid what you want,

but never come in and say
hey, I’ll accept $2 for this,

yeah sure.
— Yeah, yeah.

— You know, when they
would have paid you five.

— Yeah, I literally just
did a deal with my wife

for a local brand that was like,

«Hey, will you do this deal?»

And we’re like, «Yeah, we love your stuff,

like we would be happy to.»

They’re like, » Sure, cool,
we’ll send you some free stuff,

and you take the videos and
the photos and that’s it,»

and we’re like, «Whoa, whoa, whoa,»

and that’s where we’re at, like,

not where you should
start out like Chad said,

but we’re like, «No, we
usually charge around 5,000

for this type of thing,
— Exactly.

— and because we’ve done like PNC Bank,

and Google and like,
that’s kind of the rate

for our audience that we’ve been charging.

And they’re like, «Oh okay,»

and they came back at
like they kinda met us

a little more than halfway.
— Yeah.

— And so we’re like,

«Oh okay, we just really
wanna work with you,

and that sounds fine.»

— Yeah, exactly.

— But when is that point like
you said at the beginning,

do some free ones.

When does that pivot
happened from free to paid?

— I think there’s a few factors,

so the first factor is, is this a return,

you know, if you’ve done
one review for free,

and they come back to you.

If they’re coming to you then this is

where I think you have a little
bit more negotiating power.

Start low like, hey, if
you want a YouTube video,

just throw a number out
there, you know, like $500,

and I’ll do it plus the product.

The worst thing that could happen is,

you know, obviously, they’re
not wanting to work with you,

but that’s probably not
gonna happen unless you say,

«You know what $10,000.»

When you have enough likes or views,

or you can take your top 10 videos,

add them together,

and then divide by 10,

and get a decent average
number of views or likes,

then I think that that’s

where you have some negotiating power.

— There’s so many variables to consider

when it comes to pricing and negotiating,

and when they go from free to
paid, and charging for this.

Some of those factors would be things,

like the size of your audience,

like you’re literally selling eyeballs,

like you’re a media company in this regard

where an advertiser wants to
get in front of the people

whose attention that you command.

But there’s other things considered too

such as how authoritative is your voice

in this niche or industry?

How much do people trust
and respect your opinion

when you recommend something?

There’s also things of like,

well, how badly do you just
want to work with this company?

You know, if you’re like,

«Yeah, we just wanna
go to Disney for free,»

you know, and they pay us like that,

you could do that.
— Absolutely.

— As opposed to just like,

«No, we don’t go to Disney
unless they pay us,»

and that might be different.

It could you know, just be your
personal preference on that.

I have found for brand deals

that we don’t do very many
here at «Video Creators,»

because we have our own products
and services that we sell,

and I just prefer to
do our own integrations

for our own stuff.

But when we do brand deals
I charge like way higher

than most people,

’cause one another variable is

like is what’s worth your time.

And I know like if I
promote something of my own

this is what approximately
what it would convert at.

— Absolutely.
— This is around

how much money you will make.

And so a brand says like,

«We want to take that opportunity
that you would take Tim

and we want you to insert us instead.»

I’m like, «Okay, but
it’s gotta come at least

to this number.»

Or it doesn’t make sense to me,

and most brands balk at that.

They’re like, «How could you even charge?»

Well, technically, I don’t care,

I’m like,
— Yeah, absolutely.

— so it depends on like
how much pressure you feel

to take it.

It depends on like your
business model is as well.

There’s just so many things that you have

to consider just personally,
what is it worth to you?

What do you think your audience is worth,

your voices worth?

I did one deal with a
whole bunch of with a brand

that worth a whole bunch of creators,

and they said after the
campaign is over they said,

«Tim, you are the smallest
channel that we worked with,

but your audience
converted 18 times higher

than the largest channel we work with.»

— Yeah.
— And so there’s also

this variable of how well can you sell

just pitching a product doesn’t mean

that your audience is
actually going to buy it,

— Absolutely.
— but because I have

my own products that I sell I
know what you guys respond to.

I know what don’t respond to.

I know like, and so, and
they came back to me like,

«Tim, you are absolutely
worth that higher price,»

because my conversion was so much higher.

It sounds like what
we’re saying is just like

when you feel like you’re
ready to do it just do it.

— Yeah, I mean, do your research.

I mean, Google is limitless in
what you can learn, you know,

I mean, there’s resources, I
mean, literally you can say,

«Hey, how much should I
charge for an Instagram post

with this much following?»

What I’ll kind of give you a formula

that I feel like is fair,

and a formula that I
think is somewhat close

to what media agencies are
using and bigger advertising,

you know, is a cost per view.

Once you start getting some
traction take your likes,

or take your views, and then times them by

from anywhere from eight
to 20 cents per view,

it’ll give you a rate that
I think is pretty fair,

and then as you go you’re gonna start

feeling more comfortable
and increasing that.

— I’ve heard some people say,

«Never take their first offer.»

Is that what you’re saying?

— 100%.

— Okay.
— Yeah.

— So they cannot—
— No, unless it’s great.

Maybe you’ve worked
with them before, right?

— Yeah.

— And they come in with a great offer.

There’s no point in trying to get more

because they’re being fair.

— What if it comes in like the first offer

is already much higher
than you were thinking?

You’re like, «Yeah, I’ll do it for 200,»

and it comes in for like, 1000?

— Oh, yeah.
— Would you like, oh—

— I’ll say, «Nope, sounds good, thanks.»

— You just take it, okay.

— Yeah, because sometimes
brands don’t want

to do the negotiating with you.

They want you and that’s it,

so they’re gonna come in.

I mean, there’s been times
where brands have come into us,

come to us and said, «Hey,
we want you to do this,

and this, and we’ll pay you 15,000.»

and I go back and say,
«No, that’s worth 30,000,»

and then we’ll usually settle
maybe at that 25 grand.

But there’s been times
where they really want us

we know like there’s no,
they don’t wanna negotiate,

the times quick,

they want to make it happen,

and they’ll come and say,

«Look, we’ll offer you 35 right now.»

— And you’re like, «Okay that’s it.»

— Perfect, send the contract.

In the beginning, there’ll be some brands

that do reach out and say,

«Hey, you know, we want you know,

we’ll pay you this,

but we want this many views.»

We don’t do that, like I you know,

that’s something and I
recommend you don’t do that.

To never guarantee views,
likes, engagement, anything.

This is social media.

Especially don’t ever buy them too.

If you’re late they
terminate you from the deal.

— You never buy these,

and that’s even worse.
— That’s terrible.

— Exactly.
— For your channel

and for your reputation.

— Yeah, absolutely.

So I think that understand
that your job is not

to guarantee anything other
than high quality content

posted on time, on target.

That’s the only requirement,

the only thing that you
should ever guarantee.

Never how much engagement is gonna get,

because it’s social media.

— Do you have any tips or advice

for the negotiating process

when you don’t wanna
come across as greedy,

how do you navigate the
relational aspect of it

with the brand while also
earning what you’re worth,

and how does that dance,

any tips and advice for that?

— When it comes to negotiating

what you have to realize
is that it’s not personal.

It’s a business talking to a business.

It doesn’t have to be difficult

if you’re upfront and transparent,

and people will say, That’s
a little bit too high.»

I mean, there’s many times
where I’ll give them a rating

and they’ll be like, «That’s
a little high in our budget,»

and «Well, then you probably
should raise your budget.»

— (laughs) And you say it
flat out just like that.

— I literally will like you know,

then you probably should raise your budget

if you wanna work with us.

I’m not you know, not being difficult,

but I just know our value.

— How do you get to the point

where you have the confidence and guts

to say something like that?

As of, «Okay, I’m sorry, oh, yeah.»

— I think that, you know, I’ve
always been a blunt person,

I think that it helps if
you’re a blunt person,

but I also, you know,
I’m also a man of faith.

I know that we’re not
coming from a greedy place.

I know that we’re not trying
to get over on anybody,

so I believe that, you know,
when I’m coming at someone,

I just, I let them know

that my value means everything to me,

and I also confirm with them,

and just say I know that
your value means everything

to you, the brand’s value
means everything to them.

We’re not gonna undervalue you, the brand,

and we just don’t wanna
be undervalued either,

so I have to hold true to this.

If you wanna work with me

then let’s figure out a
way to make it happen.

— Does that ever damage the
relationship with the brand

when you’re playing a little bit more,

where feels like hardball?

Or you’re like, no, ’cause
they don’t expect it,

and if you don’t do that it almost looks

like you don’t really
know what you’re doing.

— Honestly, it is never backfired.

There’s been a few times
where brands have said,

«Well, you know unfortunately,
we don’t have a budget

right now, but we’re gonna you know,

we’ll reach back out to you,

if we have anything that’s more in line,»

and nine times out of 10
they’ve reached out later

with a brand deal.

— Okay.

— That was the right fit
and the right budget.

— Okay.

— Because they respect
the professionalism,

and they respect the fact
that you are a business.

— You said that you do the deals.

Your wife, she’s like
the primary personality,

you’re in the content, and you’re,

more like you’re more of like
a supporting the character.

— Yeah, absolutely,
she’s the main character,

and you know—

— And so there is she the one

that the brands typically
wanna work with not you?

— Yeah, I would say that 70% of the time

that they’re wanting to work with Gabriel.

— So the advantage that
you guys have that,

and I did this too which is

if she’s the one doing the negotiating,

that relationship feels
a little bit weird,

but with the middleman in there

you can play hardball a little bit more,

and it doesn’t impact their
perceived relationship with her.

And the same with me, and
this was a few years ago,

I had someone negotiating

and doing all my brand deals and contract.

He was able, even though
he was taking a cut now

of those deals he was able
to negotiate much higher,

— Absolutely.

— because they have this
perceived relationship with me

from being on camera and with my wife,

but they didn’t have one with him.

And so I feel like if
there’s an opportunity,

whether it’s just a friend,

or like, it doesn’t have to
be a professional manager,

or anything like that.
— No, not at all.

— Someone who just be like, hey,

like someone who really believes

in what you’re doing on YouTube,

really loves your vision,

and has the guts to just be like,

«I am going to get my friend
the best deal possible

in exchange for like a 10, 20, 15%.»

Like whatever 50-50, it
doesn’t really matter,

cut, percent cut then you can
command a higher price for it,

and it saves your relationship.

— Absolutely yeah, that’s perfect.

— When it comes to contracts tell us

what are the main things that
a creator should look for

in those contracts?
— Yeah.

— And I wanna preface all this by saying,

I think that whatever you pay
you need to have a lawyer.

For me, I remember some
of my first contracts,

I paid a lawyer, it was
a couple hundred dollars

to do the contract review,

but he saved me so much headache,

because it was like I read it,

I thought I knew what it said,

but he’s like, «But Tim, here’s
what’s not written in here,

that’s actually more important
than what is written in here.

You need to add this,
and have them like that.»

And I’m like, «Oh, I didn’t know that,»

so I would personally
recommend that you always go

through them with a lawyer,

and I think you guys have
a lawyer that helps you

with your contract reviews or something.

— Yeah, absolutely, I
think that’s a great point.

I came from a world
where I was looking at,

you know, government contracts,

but coming to the influencer world working

in the marketing areas is much different.

Because then you’re
talking about, you know,

not only creating the content,

but also like using my likeness.

Basically, what that means is that,

they’ll put a paragraph in there,

that brand can use your likeness,

and you know, in relation to the campaign

that you’ve done with them,

but what they’ll do is
they’ll add a bunch of ways

that they can use your likeness,

and how they can use it,

and when they can use it,

where they can use it, and they’ll try—

— How long they can use it for.

— How long they can use,

and they’ll try to sneak
in a bunch of print, TV,

ad, digital, all this extra stuff

that believe me you
should be compensated for.

Usually it uses the name
of that paragraph for use,

you know, or just the way that they can,

you know, interact with your content.

— What would you recommend
they should negotiate

for that paragraph?

— TV is usually off the table,

unless they’re willing to pay for TV use.

I mean TV uses is just that as TV use.

I mean, they’re wanting
to put your content,

or your face on national TV,

or even local TV,

it doesn’t really matter,

and that’s another rate at some point,

you know, if that goes in there
you’ll need to talk about.

A lot of times the brand will
will send you the contract,

you know, and it’ll be
to you when it should be

to your company or your LLC,

or you know, for us we
have a S Corp, you know,

so you should pay attention to that.

For me, it’s easier to funnel everything

through the company for you
know, tax purposes later

for the CPA it’s easier there.

But make sure all of that
information is accurate,

then you’re gonna go into
exclusivity of something

that’s very important.

And what I mean by that
is they’re gonna ask you

to be exclusive to that brand,

or to them for a certain period of time,

like a standard exclusively
rate for me is 30 days,

you know, like we’ll do
30 days with no extra fee.

— For with no other brand,

or just no, they’re competing brands.

— Competing brand.
— Competing brand.

— Yeah, and it’s only gonna be competing

in that product category.

— So if it was like a product,

if you’re doing something
with Target you say,

«We’ll say no to Walmart for 30 days.»

— Exactly.

— But if Canon comes along and
say, «Well, you are camera,»

like that’s not a competing category.

— Yeah, exactly,

so and even deeper they
say this is where it,

so even if they say if
it’s a Target campaign

and that you’re working in clothing,

the product category
of clothing of Target.

Walmart comes to you they
wanna work in electronics,

I’m gonna do that.

So I’m gonna make sure that they’re not,

Target is not trying to lock
me up to Target as a whole

to Walmart as a whole,

because you need to pay for that.

— Right.

— So product category of
exclusivity is very important

pay attention to it,

and that’s something
that early in our time,

you know that bit is a few times,

but that I look for that stuff now.

So you got there compensation,

make sure it’s appropriate
to what you guys agree to,

and e-mails, make sure the deliverables

that you’ve agreed upon,

you know what you’re gonna
actually create for them.

Payment terms, I would
always negotiate those down

to no more than 45 days,

net 45 because the brands
will always be late.

— I’ve charge upfront.

I’m like we don’t,
— Yeah.

— not every case, like this last one

I needed a really quick turnaround,

— Yeah.
— so we were okay.

But for the most part
like you pay us first

and then we do it,

or if the half and half or
something let’s do that.

— Yeah, most time we’re
negotiating to get 50%

at the signing of contract,

and then 50% of the end.

And I think is interesting

once you’ve built these relationships,

— Yeah.
— then they’re gonna wanna

pay you on time.

— Yeah.
— Because it’s, you know,

it’s credibility.

It’s respect.

— What about this term?

And I think it’s really important

in the contract called perpetuity.

What does that mean,

and what do you negotiate
that to for your contracts?

— It’s interesting that
you asked that about.

We don’t actually see that
in too many of our contracts,

and I don’t know if that’s reason,

because we have worked with
a lot of these brands before,

but we’re not seeing a lot of like issues,

I’ve never had to negotiate or change

— Okay.
— any of the terming,

you know, terms or you know,
under the perpetuity clauses,

or things that.

There’s never been an issue for us,

like what kind of issues have you seen?

— Yeah, those of you guys who don’t know

what perpetuity means is basically,

this is how long we
get to use these assets

that you’re creating for us,

or your likeness or your image.

They can apply it to almost anything.

By default our experience
has been like lifetime,

like forever, eternity like,

and I don’t think that’s fair,

because like, right now my value is this,

but in like, 10 years from
now, the value might be here,

but because I signed
this perpetuity contract,

like now I’m this, I don’t
know this big celebrity,

or brand has grown to something else,

and now they can continue
to use my likeness

from 10 years ago which in 10 years

in the future might be embarrassing for me

to see that even up there.

So and then we also have kids,

and so because we have kids we say,

«No, you can’t do this forever,

because we want them to be able to control

how they’re likeness and images
are used as they grow up,»

so we negotiate to a maximum
of two years of perpetuity.

We usually say one is our preference,

and our experience that
no brands ever been like,

«Oh, yeah, yeah, no problem,»

like everyone has been like, yes, we will,

that’s no problem, we understand.

Like the one we just did,

like a week or two ago or something,

like there was unlimited
like perpetuity in that,

and we said, «No, we do it to one year,»

they’re like, «Yeah, there’s no problem.»

I’m like, «We’re probably not gonna use it

after this in the next campaign

and anyway it’s no big deal.»

— I think it’s, you know,
what I’ve noticed is that

because we’re not seeing like,

so we’re not seeing that
issue where it’s more than,

you know, use for the term,

or for maybe the term plus one year.

The reason we’re not seeing it,

I think is we’re going
through these agencies,

these ad agencies.

— They’re a little more
savvy on us or something.

— They’re savvy,

they’ve already been doing this for years,

they’ve basically taken the same contract

that they’ve given to celebrities,

and then just turn it into
an influencer contract.

— Yeah.

— And that’s why most brands will work

with an agency, right,
because it’s easier.

But when a brand comes to you directly

I’ve noticed that their contracts are,

the red lines are endless.

— If you guys are looking
for a good lawyer,

I’ll recommend mine,

I’ll put a link to his website down below.

I mean, not sponsored or anything.

I just found him to be really good

and helpful in my contracts,

because he teaches me,

he’s not just like speaking,

like technical legal or something.

— Lawyer talk, yeah, yeah.

— I come out of this
conversation and feel like,

«Oh, I’ve learned something.
— Yeah.

— I feel more equipped in my business now

because of this conversation.

So I highly recommend him,

link to him down below.

How about the actual asset creation now,

like you’ve handled the contract,

everything has been signed,

and then what does it look like for you

to actually now fulfill that,

so walk us through that process?

— Usually, the first
thing that happens is,

you know, they’re gonna
ask for creative treatment

for the deliverables, you know,

so you’ll submit a creative treatment.

— What is that, what does that mean.

— So a creative a treatment
is basically you know,

if you’re contracted
to do a YouTube video,

a dedicated, you know, so
it’s fully about the brand,

and maybe Instagram posts,

and some Instagram stories,

you’re gonna give a little, you know,

paragraph about each about
what they’re gonna be,

what they’re gonna look like,

what’s the picture gonna look like?

What’s the video gonna
happen to have in the video?

Very top level, you
know, 30,000 foot level

of what’s gonna happen, you know,

and send that over so that the brand

can actually approve it.

— So they usually tell
you what to do, like,

and or do they like, «We don’t care,

do your own thing as long
as this product ends up

in your video?»

— No, I wish it was that, you know,

I wish it was that,

no, it’s submitting our
creative based on the brief,

and then they need to approve that

with like their legal team

— Okay.
— with the brands.

— So you’re like, here’s
what we’re looking for,

and you’re like, «Okay, here’s
our idea of how we’re going

to execute it.»
— Yes.

— That’s the creative brief,
— Absolutely.

— and then they look at
that, and they say yes,

or what about that?
— What about this?

— And how many back and forth.
— Exactly.

— When do you like, is
there ever a time when you

or you just cancel the whole
thing at that after that,

or is it just more of a like a little?

— There’s been like one or two times

where I’ve just canceled it,

and I said, «You know what, let’s go ahead

and cancel the contract you
guys don’t know what you want.

I’m not gonna create.

This is what we agreed to create.

I’m not gonna create that,

that’s not even true to us.»

But yeah, usually it’s pretty easy.

There’s maybe once or
once you back and forth.

— Talking through the back and forth,

and then you settle on like,

«Okay, this is the direction
we’re gonna go with the video.»

— Yeah.
— After that,

then you go ahead and just shoot it,

and how do you guys do that
integration then at that point?

— Always have a kickoff call,

I think it’s important after
you’ve signed a contract,

always have a call with the
brand to go over the brief.

So you can talk, you know, voice to voice,

even face to face if you want,

you know, on a Zoom or something.

Talk to them and tell
them about the importance

of them letting you be you.

Because a lot of times
there’s these expectations

that you’re gonna be exactly
what they want you to be.

And marketing companies, PR companies,

have a very commercially market field

that they’re looking for,

whether they say they are or not,

that’s just what they’re used to creating.

So you gotta let them know that look,

I’m not creating commercial for you.

I’m creating social content
that matches my brand,

but also highlights the
brand that you want me to.

I’m creating something
that’s already a gain for me.

— I’m lending my voice to you,

— Yes.
— and adding my credibility

that I’ve earned with my
audience to your brand.

— Yes exactly.

So I that’s important to be upfront

with because sometimes you’ll
send something that’s great,

it’s perfectly and
there’s been a few times,

and they come out like, «Well,
we thought it was gonna be

a little bit more like this.»

I’m like, «No, it’s a commercial.»

— Are there any questions
that you find yourself

regularly needing to ask
just for clarification?

— I would say the one that I asked a lot,

the question I asked a lot is.

what like, is the main message?

There’ll be key messages
that they’ll give you.

It usually be four or five,

but what’s the main one?

If I had to hit one, and I had to send it,

hit it out the part,

what does that mean one?

Because you could literally
take that one message

and steer the entire piece
of content around it,

and then, you know, plug
in the other ones there

when they fit.

But there’s usually one
that’s like that the main one,

and it might help you tell
the story really well.

When we’re shooting a
video or we’re shooting,

you know, content, we will overshoot

so that we have the content.

So you pay for a two minute video

I’m gonna give you a two minute video,

maybe 2:10 or whatever.
— Right.

— But I might have 20 minutes of footage

— Right.
— But that’s just there

for like, you know, maybe edits,

or maybe they had some notes,

maybe have something better put in there.

There’s times where we are
contracted for three stories,

you know for you know,
three frames of IG story,

and we might give them five,

because it just flowed better.

— Yeah, yeah.
— Right.

— And that’s okay.
— Yeah.

— And they’re gonna appreciate that,

but they’re also just gonna
appreciate high quality content

that matches exactly what
you’re contracted for.

— How do you deliver it to them

you just make an unlisted video on YouTube

and send it to them?

Do you use a different service,

— Yeah.
— or what does that look like?

— We’ll upload it if it’s a YouTube,

you know, clip or even a
video then we’ll upload it,

make it unlisted send it over to them.

— And then they give you the thumbs up or?

If you’ve done all the pre-work, right,

I’m assuming you get a
thumbs up almost every time.

Well, you wanna avoid
as like they’re like,

«Oh no, you I can’t reshoot all that?»

— And submit the deadline?

— Well, so we don’t agree to reshoots.

— So do you reshoot any revisions?

— We agree to you know,
up to two revisions.

— Two revisions, okay.

— But we don’t agree—
— Yeah, it’s in the contract.

— Yeah, but we do not agree to reshoot.

The possibility of recreating
the way you look for something

is just unrealistic.
— The continuity

is really different.
— Yeah, unrealistic,

so you end up having to
completely reshoot everything.

— Right?

— And that, so we just don’t agree to it.

— Okay.

— But we’ve been it a long time,

and we take it serious,

and we’re very professional,

we make sure that we don’t miss things.

But there’ll be times
where you’re gonna get,

you know, the brand’s
gonna come back and say,

‘Hey, is there anyway you can edit this.

and you might maybe edit this,»

and it might be annoying,

it might be like, you know,
«That didn’t make any sense.’

But you know, you pick your battles,

you know, if it’s a small money change,

it’ll make them happy and
it doesn’t really affect you

just make the change.

If it’s something that changes the essence

of what the video is,

and you know, it really changes your style

and it becomes something else, push back.

I think it’s important
again to hold your ground,

and again, this is not personal,

this is a professional business
to business relationship.

— So you publish the video
what happens after that?

— Yeah.
— Is there any follow up,

or do you send like reports,

or hey, thank you so much.

You send them a little
thank you gift or like,

I don’t know what is your follow up,

what happens after that for you guys?

— Yeah, usually you see it’s e-mail,

«Hey, everything’s Live,

thank you so much.

This was a great partnership.

Hope we can continue this
and do something different,

or continue with this one.

By the way invoice will
be heading your way.

We’ll use bill.com.»

A few days later we’ll go you know,

if they haven’t asked for
analytics I’ll send them over.

If it was in the contract,

if it wasn’t in the contract
to send our analytics

then I won’t.

If they ask me, you know, then
I’ll still send them to them,

but I’m not gonna do it if
it wasn’t in the contract.

— Do you ever feel bad
when you post a video

and you typically get 50,000 views,

and this one got like 20.

Do you like, «Oh guys, I’m so sorry,»

and they paid you a lot of
money for it, you know and just.

— No, no, because—

— And you’re like,
«Suck it up, I’m sorry.»

— No, I mean, ’cause it is what it is.

People come and watch your
content for the native

like the content that they’re used to.

For us as a daily vlog,

that’s what they come for.

They come for whatever reason it is.

They grab their popcorn,

they got their drinks,

they drink the coffee in the morning,

they watch our vlog.

If it’s a branded video,

the loyal loyal peeps

that we’ve got will watch
it regardless just because,

but some people they’re
not there for that,

and they might not watch it.

— But if the brand comes like

if they push you a little bit though,

and they’re like, «Hey man, what happened?

I only got 20,000 instead of 55.

We thought we’re gonna get 50,000.»

Do you just say,

«Sorry, the contract
didn’t promise anything?»

— No, they don’t ever think that,

’cause I’m upfront in the beginning that.

— That’s good.

So you set the manage
expectations upfront.

— The manage expectation upfront.

— Like this might under
deliver, no, that’s—

— No, but I tell them,

I tell him straight up
that I recommend, you know,

integrations over dedicated videos,

because integrations are just
right into a normal vlog,

it flows, people, you know, will watch it,

and then move on to the vlog.

— It doesn’t feel like a commercial.

— Exactly, a dedicated video
is gonna be more commercially.

It’s obviously about the brand,

and you gotta try to make
that as organic as possible,

and I let them know
upfront that these videos,

they’ll probably be
maybe 15, 20, you know,

maybe 30% lower in views.

But you know, 20,000 views
compared to 40,000 views

is still really good.

This is a brand new video,

they just got 20,000 views

that’s a success.

— When it comes to we’ve
been talking so far

about like YouTube perspective.

And I know, you guys actually

do most of your deals on Instagram.

— Yeah.
— Right?

So is there anything
different in this conversation

that like is unique to Instagram

that you would like
I’m curious like I got,

’cause it’s very common
for YouTube influencers

to also have Instagram.
— Absolutely.

— So is there anything different

about this conversation
that would be unique

for the Instagram approach?

— No, it’s pretty much the same process.

I mean, there’s not much difference there.

I think that the biggest
thing is in on Instagram

is the few different factors
that are gonna change,

you know, Instagram stories,

don’t undervalue Instagram stories,

you can charge for Instagram stories like,

and you can charge a decent amount.

They’re important, people watch, you know,

Instagram stories, and they swipe up,

so don’t ever think that that’s,

because they go away that
you shouldn’t charge much,

then also, link in a bio,

brands are gonna ask you
to put a link in your bio.

We never agreed to do a soul link there.

We agreed to throw in our link tree.

— Okay.
— Yeah.

We’re never gonna give
you the entire real stuff.

— The extend of a link
tree is basically like,

you put one link in there,

and then it expands to a
whole, a bunch of links.

and you just kind of put
at the top or something?

— We’ll put at the top there

for whatever the agreed amount of time,

and because we’re not gonna sacrifice

promoting the other stuff we wanna promote

just for the brand.

— Pricing difference between,

how do you figure that out for Instagram?

— Pricing is still under
that cost per view,

cost per like, you know—

— So for 20 cents per heart, basically.

— Yeah, you know.

— But how do you gauge that for a story?

— Stories, we kind of do views still,

but we’re doing it a
little bit lower rate,

I would say that we’re doing it,

like the 10 to 12 cents per view there.

Just because it does go away.

— I got a couple good questions
from you guys on Twitter,

as well as on our YouTube
Community tab here.

So this one from Welcome to
Chickenlandia is her name

and she’s like, do you
recommend getting contracts

from companies when you make a brand deal,

or should you supply
your own contract to them

and make them sign yours?

— That’s a great question.

Absolutely make them sign the contract.

For one it’s their contract
when they present it to you,

it’s gonna be approved by their legal.

You send them a contract
their legal is gonna have

to approve it.

It’s gonna take, be a lot longer

and the process is gonna
be a little more difficult,

and not because your
contract won’t be good,

but your contract is not theirs.

— Have you’re bumped into like
a like as a smaller business

and they just don’t have a contract,

and don’t know what one should look like.

Would you then supply your own,

or do you just go on a gentleman’s
handshake at that point,

or never do gentleman’s handshake

in the absence of a contract?
— No, no, we do not,

we don’t do gentle ladies
or gentlemen handshakes.

— Not even gentle fist bumps.

— No, no gentle fist bumps,

and you know, no, you need a contract.

You need an agreement,

and I believe that any
organization, any business,

they have contracts,

they have the ability to get a contract.

Again, you are the influencer,

you’re the one that’s
providing a service for them.

They should provide the contract,

that’s not too much to ask.

— Logan Allec on the
YouTube Community tab asked,

how would you find someone
and seek them out to,

who would negotiate brand deals for you,

and what’s a fair compensation for them?

How would you figure out what’s fair?

Like we talked a little bit about that,

but where would you find
someone maybe more professional

at doing just that thing?

And at what point is your channel ready

for something like that,

and what’s a fair rate?

— Some people might tell
you to go, you know,

join a YouTube Network.

I would honestly stay away from that

not because they’re, you
know, horrible people,

or horrible organizations,

it’s just I don’t think
that you need that,

especially when you’re small.

I don’t think that you
need a network taking any

of your percentage of your of your cut.

And I don’t think you’re
gonna get that return,

but we have someone that
actually brings us brand deals,

we don’t use them all the time,

but she’s out there
looking for brand deals

on a regular basis.

And so she is getting 15% of
what she brings us, right,

so wherever the brand deal is.

So she knows what our rates are,

so that means she has to
negotiate a little bit higher.

— Right?

— I think that the way you’re gonna come

about finding the right
people is use your community.

You might very well have
someone that’s watching you,

that, you know is a good negotiator.

Honestly, you just need somebody
that’s a good negotiator

then you can also reach
out to some agencies,

some actual traditional talent agencies

and ask if they do work with influencers,

and just ask those questions,

that well, if you did,
how much would you charge,

you know, to work, helped me, you know,

manage my brand deals.

So there’s ways there,

but never be willing
to give more than 15%.

I mean, honestly, you know,
if I said to give you a number

of where you should be
before you even did that,

I would say 50,000 subscribers,

and more, maybe you can
start thinking about that,

but anything below that I
promise you can handle yourself.

— We just said and then
just do some Google searches

for social media influencer agencies, or—

— Yeah,

— ’cause I also found
like, there’s some big ones

that pop up when you do that,
— There is.

— but there’s also a lot
of like just individuals

who like actually the most of the creators

and influencers that I know,

they all kinda like use one, or two,

or three different people,

and they don’t even have a website.

— Yeah.

— Like, there’s no way
to get in touch with them

other than to have someone
else recommend you.

— Yeah, that’s like—
— It’s like word of mouth

or so.
— Word of mouth.

— It kind of feels like
to the viewer like,

but if I don’t know those people

how do I get in touch with those people?

And it feels like, it’s a
networking of networking thing

that they might feel excluded from?

— Yeah, you’re right, and
no, it can’t be that way,

but you know, it’s
definitely word of mouth,

and sometimes it’s about who, you know,

right?
— Yeah, it definitely is.

— But I think that you
can do enough research,

or you know, I mean,
connect with Tim here,

and you know, learn about
connecting, collaborating,

you know, collabing
with other influencers,

build those relationships, you know,

because that’s where you’re
gonna get advice, tips,

and even help.

— So the way I did it is
even though I have friends

who do that I just,

I found a kind of what
you’re recommending.

I did on my own for a little while,

but then just got a friend
of mine who is like,

he was just like, «Yeah, train
me, I’ll do it.» like I am.

The thing that they don’t have
is that some of them agencies

and managers have is like,

they often come with built
in relationships with brands.

— Yeah.
— So they can get you

some stuff pretty quickly,

and they also have a lot more experience.

But you’re gonna pay a
high premium for that,

and you’re also going

to need to be a sizeable channel for that.

— And there’s no guarantee
with that either.

— Just that, right,
there’s still no guarantee.

So I preferred to be like,

I just want someone who
embodies my core values,

and our beliefs, and what we’re all about

in representing ourselves to brands,

as well as to our audience.

And I would rather
teach someone the skills

or figure it out as we go,

than kinda feel like,

«Well, I don’t know anyone,

I don’t know how to do this,

and I gotta get to a million subs first.»

The person we hired was
just a friend of ours,

— Yeah, that’s smart.
— and he did a great job.

Armed Scholar, asks does your
pricing and tactics change

if a brand wants to enter
into a long term sponsorship?

I guess ongoing would you give a discount

if they wanna do a series of
videos versus just like one?

— Yes, we actually just agreed to,

and are about to contract the largest deal

that we have ever done.

It’s a six figure deal over a
course of about seven months.

I would say that we probably took

about a 25% pay cut on deliverables,

if we add it all up and charge exactly

what we charge—

— Per asset.

— per asset thing.

But that’s okay, you know, that’s okay

when you’re building a
long, long term partnerships

are much better than one offs,

or working with a brand one time,

because it’s not only good
for you and the brand,

because now they’re building
like this relationship.

But it’s also it’s allowing you to say,

«Look at this resume that I
did with this corporation,

with this large organization.»

Always be willing to negotiate,

always be willing to
take a little bit less

than what your standard rate is,

but have a standard,

and then understand

that they wanna do a long
term partnership with you,

that’s a good thing,

because it not only can open up doors

in that division you’re working in,

but maybe in other divisions
within that organization.

— Question from Steve Lehto,

ask how can you tell if
an offer is legit or not?

Because sometimes we get
those real like I don’t know.

— Look at the signature block,

look at the e-mail address.

If it’s coming from a Gmail or a Yahoo,

and there’s no signature block,

personally, I’d probably ignore it.

— It says dear sir/madam.

— Definitely when it says dear sir/madam.

— Yeah.

— If it’s not personalized to you,

or if it’s like, you know,
it just says dear influencer,

or if it has a bunch of
undisclosed recipients,

if it’s not, if you didn’t
take the time to e-mail me,

and our brand to work with us

then it’s probably not a deal to be made,

you know, and if you’re
not sure e-mail them back,

and say, «Yes, I’m interested
in hearing more about this.

What’s the compensation?

What are you expecting me to do?»

And if it’s legitimate,
they’re gonna come back

with a decent offer.

If they’re going to come,

or they might come back and say,

«Yeah, we want you to
do seven YouTube videos,

and we’ll pay you $300,»

and that’s not fair for anybody.

I don’t care if your channel
has 5,000 subscribers

that’s ridiculous. (laughs)

— Yeah, yeah.

— So you’ll know, you’ll quickly know.

So ask the question again, ask questions.

So if you’re not sure about the e-mail,

and you’re interested ask them,

what do they want and how
much they gonna pay you?

— One last question for me.
— Okay.

— That’s something that I feel
especially those of you guys

who are a little bit more on the like,

«I’m getting started
with brand deals with us

while you’re watching this is especially

when you get this first
one or two that come in,

you’re like, ah, I can
make this thing fit,

but I don’t know if I should force it.

but I really wanna take
it ’cause I need the money

so how do you draw that line
when you should say yes,

and when you should say no?

And like clear, practical reasoning,

like how do they make that decision,

and to get to that place?
— It’s a good question.

Yeah, it’s a good question.

I think that if you see a
way to promote this brand,

or this product, or
service, or whatever it is,

not, because maybe you don’t use it,

or you know, you don’t
necessarily need it,

but maybe your audience does,

you know, if it fits your audience,

you know, and what your
audience you know, likes,

and again, analytics will tell you kind

of what your audience
watches outside of you,

then maybe you consider it, right.

You know what, I’m not
necessarily gonna use it,

but I can tell the story of
why it’s good for my audience.

— So would you promote something

that you don’t personally use?

— It depends, yeah, like, for instance,

we worked with Samsung,

we’re iPhone users,

nothing against Samsung phones,

but we’re just you know,
we’re iPhone users.

But I know that a lot of our subscribers,

our peeps are Samsung users.

There’s a lot of people use them.

So it was a good way
opportunity for us to say,

«Hey, we don’t use these
you know, we don’t,

but we know a lot of you do,

and these are great phones.

I mean, they take good pictures,

like the quality is great.»

— So you just disclose like,

«Hey, we don’t use this product.»

— And you guys know we
don’t use this, but—

— Great yeah, yeah.

And the brand doesn’t, you
tell the brand that upfront?

— And they know that
from beginning because,

but they see the value in us a non

you know, Android user
talking about their product

to people that do use them?

— Do you get called like a
sellout for that or anything?

— No, because we’re upfront.

But I think it’s just
important to if it feels wrong,

it feels like something
that you don’t wanna do,

or it’s gonna turn your audience off

then it’s better to say no.
— Yeah.

— I know the money’s enticing, but—

— Go with your gut.
— Go with your gut.

— If don’t feel there’s any
sort of twinge, you’re like,

oh, I can force the square
peg into the round hole.

— Yeah.

— Don’t, and because—

— Turn your audience off.

— Exactly, you’re damage,

if you’re doing, you’re
taking a temporary award

for a long term sacrifice.

— You’re taking a bandaid
that’s not big enough

for the scar that you’re gonna have.

(both laughing)

So—
— Yeah,

it damages the trust and
relationship you have

with your audience.
— Absolutely.

— And is there any amount
of money that’s worth that?

I don’t think so,

but there might be everyone’s
got a price, I guess so.

— Yeah, yeah, I don’t know.

We’ve never been presented
one that was worth it

at that point,

but staying true to your brand,

staying true to the kind
of content you create

is gonna benefit you in the long run.

— Yeah, the filter I
kinda think of is like,

is this something that
one I can recommend,

and two for me personally
I wanna have used it

before I just recommend.

Like you use the phone
so that you could tell

it took a picture.

— Yeah, we filmed a little
video with it, yeah absolutely.

— But sometimes I get like,

«Hey, Tim, we promote our
Royalty Free Music Library

to other creators.»

There was one that I use and
they kept coming up getting,

I’m glad I use it first

’cause every single
one’s a Content ID match.

And I was like, ooh, if
I had just promoted this

without testing it first,

I would have lost a lot of credibility

— Absolutely.
— with my audience.

So I always test it, use it my,

I don’t guarantee I’m
like send me the product.

I’ll check it out,

and if it works out and we actually use it

then I’ll promote it,

but then my recommendation will
have more credibility to it.

— Yeah.

— because I actually used it,

and you can talk more
authoritatively about it.

So if at any point something comes up,

and I’m like yes, you can wear it,

but I don’t really know
then I will just like,

I’ll probably just like go.

— Smart.

And most of time you don’t ever regret it.

Most time you’re like, «You know what?

I’m glad I didn’t do that.»

— Yeah.
— Yeah.

— I think one of the best ways

to learn how to do a lot of this stuff

is to see it actually played out,

and see it actually in action.

So we put together a short playlist

you can click right over there,

you go to some of GabeBabe TV’s
best and brand integrations

and look at how they do it,

pay attention to how they
integrate the product,

how they pitch it,

and how natural it is,

and take some tips ideas
by watching it in action,

so click that playlist over there.

You can find that link to
the channel also down below,

and we’ll see you over,

and he’ll see you in the next video.

— That’s right.

Ответить